Poll

Should we alter the current massive damage rule?

Yes
2 (100%)
No
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 2

Voting closed: August 31, 2011, 02:48:46 PM

Author Topic: Massive Damage  (Read 7971 times)

Offline Asinjin

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Massive Damage
« on: August 24, 2011, 02:48:46 PM »
Let's discuss.
The hand that rolls the Dice rules the world.

Offline Valdis

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2011, 03:00:39 PM »
Can you summarize the current set of rules?

Offline Asinjin

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2011, 07:23:32 PM »
If a medium sized creature takes 40 or more points of damage from one physical attack, the creature must make a DC15 Fortitude saving throw or die.  For every five points over 40, the save increase by 1.  So a medium sized creature that takes 100 hit points from one attack must make a DC27 Fortitude saving throw.  For every size category larger than medium, the amount of damage required to cause a massive damage save is increased by 10.  It is reduced by 10 for every size category smaller than medium, to a minimum of 20 points of damage.
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Offline Valdis

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2011, 09:41:36 AM »
Ok, well, I had this long drawn-out explanation about how it's pretty ridiculous that a 5th level character with a Greatsword, power attack, and leap attack can cause up to Gargantuan sized creatures to make a massive Damage save on a critical hit (it is referred to as 'Koth-ing' and/or 'Acyll-ing' in the rest of this post).  Koth-ing will do between 11.8% and 36% of a Gargantuan creatures total hit points worth of damage.  I was ok with 33+% of your total Hit Points causing a massive damage save, but 12%, not so much.  It would be like dying because someone shot you in the ass with a b-b gun.

Then I though about it some more.  What about a blanket 50% of your hp forces the save?  Sounds, ok.  But in practice, you'd be making those saves left and right, especially at lower levels.  a 5th level fighter has an average of 30 hit points, so every time he takes more than 15 points of damage from an attack he would have to make a save.  That's a pretty low threshold, especially when his fotitude bonus is only +4.

I think that the rule is fine the way it is, but maybe add a bonus to the saving throw if the total damage done, that causes the save, is less than 50% of your total hit points

Offline Zunder

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2011, 01:44:25 PM »
Considering I've lost 3 characters to this rule, it's stupid and should be taken out.




Offline Zunder

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2011, 01:51:18 PM »
How about a compromise.  Massive damage saves should only be allowed for Critical Hits, or something gets cut off (vorpal/sharpness).  To me, that makes sense.  If you shot a giant in the bum with a arrow, he shouldn't be able to die, especially if he's got 400 hp.  However if you shoot him in the kidney (critical) then it makes sense.


I think the rule whatever it is, needs to change.  % doesn't work cause of low levels, or people with a ton of hp. 


Offline Hero

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #6 on: August 27, 2011, 11:34:20 PM »
So how about making it so a failed massive damage save causes you to drop to -1 hp instead of insta-death? At higher levels where you should easily be able to make a DC 15 Fort save, a 5% chance of going unconscious is much more palatable than a 5% chance of dying.

Offline Asinjin

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2011, 12:49:18 PM »
What about keeping the current rule, but making it so that a 1 does not automatically fail.  That means that at high levels, when your Fortitude save is +14 or higher, you have no chance of missing the save.
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Offline Windblade

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2011, 01:04:39 PM »
Since it is our rule I feel it is ok to make a little complicated to fit our needs.  How about you don't automatically miss on a 1.  Also if the hit does more then 50% of your HP then you die if your miss your save.  If the hit does less then 50% of your HP but still causes you to make a massive damage save then you are only reduced to -1.

Offline Zunder

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2011, 08:41:47 PM »
Since it is our rule I feel it is ok to make a little complicated to fit our needs.  How about you don't automatically miss on a 1.  Also if the hit does more then 50% of your HP then you die if your miss your save.  If the hit does less then 50% of your HP but still causes you to make a massive damage save then you are only reduced to -1.


I like that!


Even though it wouldn't have saved any of my characters.


Or.. you get reduced to -1 unless a critical was involved.  Then you die.

Offline Asinjin

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2011, 10:03:56 PM »
So same rules for what triggers the save.  Eliminate the auto fail on a 1.  If the attack does under 50% of your remaining hit points, than you are not killed, but rather knocked out.
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Offline Hero

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #11 on: August 28, 2011, 10:13:06 PM »
Using 50% of your remaining hp will make it pretty cumbersome. I think it should be 50% of your total hp.

Offline Windblade

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2011, 11:22:34 PM »
I agree with hero and that is what intended to say with my post although I didn't make it clear.

Offline Windblade

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #13 on: August 28, 2011, 11:24:37 PM »
I am in favor of changing what triggers the save but I am not sure what would work best.  I am also ok with testing out the new rule and see if meets our needs.

Offline Valdis

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Re: Massive Damage
« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2011, 08:43:18 AM »
So same rules for what triggers the save.  Eliminate the auto fail on a 1.  If the attack does under 50% of your remaining hit points, than you are not killed, but rather knocked out.

This sounds good to me.  I like tom's suggestion to test it out to see if it works in game.  With Drew DMing, i'm pretty sure we'll get a chance to test it out.....often